Show: Interactive Wrestling Radio
Guest: David Penzer
Date: 02/03/2025
Your Host: James Walsh
David Penzer is a name that has been welcomed into the living rooms of pro wrestling fans for decades. From announcing and introducing the WCW side of the Monday Night Wars to being a part of TNA and Impact Wrestling off and on for years, Penzer’s booming voice has introduced the biggest names ever in pro wrestling in stadiums and arenas all over the United States. The man who sat ringside has two new books out which tell a wonderful story of his entire wrestling career and beyond. Seeing the business from within and working alongside such legends as Hulk Hogan, Randy Savage, Bobby Heenan, Gene Okerlund, and beyond – David Penzer’s “Sitting Ringside” Volume 1 and 2 are must-read books for any fan of the wrestling business from 1995 onward.
Joining us for the 4th time with his original visit coming back in 2003, David opens up like never before in our conversation talking about his issues with Josh Mathews in Impact Wrestling, his knowledge of the problems between Chris Benoit and Nancy Benoit, the rise and fall of the XWF brand, and so much more.
Fans interested can also order Sitting Ringisde Volume 1 and Volume 2 from David Penzer’s official site and get bonus materials including the formats for Ric Flair’s Last Match, the final WCW Monday Nitro, the empty arena match between Kenny Omega and Rich Swann as AEW took on TNA, and a lot of other goodies that collectors like myself would love to get our grubby paws on! All if it can be purchased now at www.DavidPenzerBook.com. Tell ’em the Wrestling Epicenter sent you!
If you use this content on your site, we only ask that you link back to our site, www.WrestlingEpicenter.com. Thank you!
DAVID PENZER:
On doing the voice recording for the audiobook of his Sitting Ringside book:
“It is extremely difficult. I had a panic attack reading chapters two and three. And, it is difficult because you have to read it word for word and I’m not used to doing that. For over 40 years, whether I’ve been a DJ or doing announcing, I never read word for word. So, if you handed me a script and I had to read back our conversation from today, it starts to be a blur. It starts to all run together. I had Guy send it to me in double space. So, it is a lot easier to read. But, you’d be surprised how uncomfortable it is to read your own story in your voice word for word.”
On the reaction from his peers on his book:
“I’ll tell you, it has been really strong. I’ve had a lot of people who I’ve worked with and mean a lot to me like Charles Robinson, Cody Deaner, Chris Jericho…. I am very proud of the fact that on Amazon.com, we have not gotten a review lower than 5 stars. I wear that as a badge of honor. I’m not sure everyone has enjoyed it as much as that sounds. But, if they don’t, tell me. I’ve been in the wrestling business or over 30 years. You can’t hurt my feelings. Tell me. But, so far, I’ve had nothing but good reviews. I’m very proud of that.”
On the differences between Volume 1 and Volume 2:
“The first one is my journey into pro wrestling and into WCW and obtaining the impossible but got there until it all crashed into the beach of Panama City, Florida. The second volume is about how you stay involved when there is only one company. How I was able to stay out there.”
On Jimmy Hart meaning so much to him:
“Like, with Jimmy Hart. I’ve been involved in every Jimmy Hart project since then. Not only would I be involved, I’d be the first person that he would call. He’d say, “Hey, I’ve got something going. Are you interested?” “Hell yeah, I’m interested!” So, I called Jimmy and told him he’s going to get an aknowledgment because you always used me. It didn’t matter if it was WCW Saturday Night, Memphis Wrestling, pay-per-views, or whatever, he would always use me and have me involved. Jimmy said, “That is because I’m smart. I know you’re good at what you do.” To me, that is like the highest honor anybody could give me. It wasn’t because he likes me or because I worked cheap or anything like that. He did it because he felt I added value to his product.It almost gets me emotional when I think on that.”
On the XWF using music legends like Alice Cooper, Gene Simmons of KISS, & WIllie Nelson for their tapings:
“A lot of that was Brian Knobbs. Knobbs knew Willie Nelson. Knobbs and Jimmy Hart knew Gene Simmons from the KISS Demon deal in WCW. It was almost like a right of passage. You grow up, you go to high school, you graduate, you start a family, you party with Brian Knobbs, and you retire. Who doesn’t want to party with Knobbs? But, yeah, using everything we had was sort of what we felt we had to do because we might not get a second chance at it. And, there wasn’t a second chance.”
On hanging with Gene Simmons:
“I got to hang with Gene Simmons a little bit which people always think is cool. Certainly full of himself but in a way that is not upsetting. He sort of pulls it off. He came off as “I’m a big deal” but it was cool because I’m getting to hang out with him and he’s a big deal! Super nice guy. He bought us dinner at the Nasty Convention in Las Vegas and he didn’t have to do that. He came to our (XWF) booth when we were trying to sell the show and he didn’t get paid for that. I was surprised he did it because there isn’t much he does without getting paid. But, I think that speaks to how much he liked Dale. You know, Gene’s deal is he is all about marketing. KISS everything. So, he thought it was cool to have the KISS Demon as a wrestler because it opened the door for things like action figures, T shirts, and things like that. That is the kind of thing that madee him tick. It wasn’t just “I just sold 100,000 tickets in this stadium.” I’m sure he loved that too. But, he loved to grow his brand in unique ways.”
On Eddy Mansfield claiming he had the XWF a TV Deal with USA Network and the Nasty Boys didn’t sign it because it was a 13 week trial for little money:
“Well, we all bullshit a little. I can bullshit, Eddy can bullshit. We didn’t like each other much back then – We’re cool now. But, back then, we didn’t like each other. As for the TV deal, I had not ever heard that. I have no doubt that there was a possibility he had something where someone said there was a deal but maybe the money got pulled or something like that. I’m sure if they had a chance at a run on USA Network, they (the Nasty Boys) would have started things up because they had already put their money on 5 episodic shows that cost a lot of money to produce. They could have said they would run it but it would cost $500,000 per episode to record. Hell, even today I could put on a wrestling show on television somewhere – It might be a shit station. But, it would be on. Not that USA Network is or was a shit station. But, I’m sure if it was USA Network, it was not going to be on a prime time slot.”
On why the XWF didn’t get picked up:
“As Knobbs and I like to say, we got all these guys their jobs back (with WWE). We had Hulk Hogan for the first one and he went back to WWE. We had Curt Hennig, he went back. We had Jerry “The King” Lawler on commentary with Tony Schiavone Jerry had left the WWE a few months before and the day of the tapings in Orlando, he told us that WWE offered him his job back. He still did the tapings. But, when people would say, “You’ve got Jerry Lawler and Tony Schiavone, what a great team.” We had to say, “Well, we don’t have Jerry anymore.””
On In Your Face Entertainment, his booking agency:
“Oh yeah, I was the exclusive booker for Teddy hart and his clan of Natalya and Jack Evans.” On what issues Teddy had: “Well, it is called being bipolar. I don’t know that for sure. But, it is a lot more common than people realize. I felt bad for his father. His father was one of the smartest guys I’ve met in the pro wrestling business and I’ve met 10’s of thousands of people. He really believed in Teddy but Teddy couldn’t get it done. He could in the ring. But, personality wise, and emotionally, he couldn’t get there. If Teddy had listened to him (is father) I think he could have gone down as one of the biggest stars in the wrestling business.”
On Dixie Carter’s role and her success with TNA:
“Dixie is a nice lady. Did she let the attention, success, and power get to her head? Absolutely! If you read the first volume of my book, there was a time I was full of myself at the end of WCW. Not a major douche but I had a few friends I knew before I got into wrestling who I had to apologize to for blowing them off. Things like that. I got a big head. And, I think Dixie would admit she got a big head. But, she was a nice lady. I have nothing bad to say about Dixie. But, I will say that she was under the belief that the fans should be yelling and screaming the whole night long. And, she was paying me, so that is what I tried to get done. But, it presented a couple problems. Number one, if they’re screaming all of the time, A. They’re going to get tired. And B. It doesn’t allow things to feel special. There are times during a match that you don’t want the fans screaming, technical wrestling, so they can come up and not be screaming and yelling all the freaking time. But, that was a small thing. I spoke to her at Slammiversary and gave her a big hug. I always liked her husband Serg. I tried to get her on my podcast when I did it… She wouldn’t. But, I’ve got to give her credit, she hasn’t done any podcasts!”
On Bob Ryder:
“You know, one guy who knew where all the bodies were buried as they say was Bob Ryder. From WCW to TNA, he knew all of the secrets. I think he would have been an amazing podcast guest if he were alive… Maybe Conrad Thompson could have twisted his arm to do a 10 episode special.”
On Bob Ryder’s WCW Live partner, current WWE Higher Up, Jeremy Borash:
“Jeremy Borash and I had a Jerry Seinfeld and Newman like relationship. He didn’t like me very much. He was a Vince Russo guy and I was a Kevin Sullivan guy. But, even though he didn’t like me, I respect what he has done. He did what he had to do to get to a spot he wanted to be at and once he got there, he wanted more. I watched him in the conference room in Orlando, he taught himself how to edit television! He bought an editing suite and all of a sudden he’s editing all of these amazing packages, he did all of that Hardy Compound stuff, and now he’s got himself a job as the VP of Content with WWE. That story might top my story that hard work pays off!”
On his issues with Josh Mathews:
“Guy (Evans, co-author of the book) always says I never bury anybody in the books. But, the one guy I will bury because they are fresh wounds is Josh Mathews. So, if you buy the book, you will find out what a condescending, disrespectful douchebag Josh Mathews is. That might be a good reason to buy the book!”
On why he has an issue with Josh Mathews:
“I knew I was leaving Impact Wrestling six months before I left. I was cool with it. I was at peace with it. Quite frankly, I was also getting tired of all of the travel. But, I was watching the first pay per view from Las Vegas after I left and my wife asked, “Do you miss it?” I didn’t! I’m going through this whole journey – Doing this book and talking to podcasts is kind of like therapy for me. But, I’ve realized the reason I don’t miss it is because he (Josh Mathews) couldn’t disrespect me anymore. He couldn’t be a prick anymore. He couldn’t make me feel like a piece of shit anymore. A part of it thinsk it is because he’s just a different kind of cat. Another part of me makes me think it is because a part of him knows that I’m the guy that got him a spot in the XWF, paid him $500 a week. The XWF had 3 guys under contract – Josh Mathews, Kid Kash, and Emory Hale. They were our developmental guys. We kept them under contract so they couldn’t go anywhere else unless we approved it. Part of me thinks that because of how full of himself he is, that bothers him in places he doesn’t think about. That in part of his brain, he doesn’t like that I was part of getting him his start and he wants to be a dick. You can’t be a dick to me anymore, Josh!”
On if he regrets writing about Josh Mathews:
“I love his wife (Madison Rayne)! That’s the shame. I love Madison Rayone, Ashley. She’s one of my favorite people in the business, if I had to say. I think I even apologize to her in the book.”
On if the Chris Benoit murder/suicide coverage exposed what the media in the US is really like:
“There is an interesting question. I’m a political junkie. If I’m home working, I’ve either got CNN or FOX News on, not so much MSNBC but maybe ABC News at night… I want to hear all perspectives. A lot of people were like, “If Trump wins, I’m leaving the country.” If Biden had won, that would have been one thing. But, when Trump won, I was like, “Buckle your safety belts, it is going to be interesting!” But, that is what people voted for. Because, that is what people wanted! I just wanted to see who won. I’m obsessed with how the media reacts. I’m obsessed with the characters. Because, at the end of the day, they are characters. I don’t really talk politics much unless there is something that directly effects me.”
On Chris Benoit’s murder suicide:
“It is an interesting question (about the media) because he was a sociopath. Look, they were grabbing at straws at the time. But, I knew what happened. Whatever happened behind those gates of that house, I knew what happened. There were only three people in that house. Chris, nancy, and their little boy which, to this day, blows my mind that Chris took his life. As you know, I was a part of a small group. Regal and his wife, me and my wife, Chris and Nancy, David Taylor and his wife, and a few others. We are all friends. Whenever we were on the road, their kids would babysit our kids, and so on and so forth. I started to see, in a social situation, in the Chris Benoit, Nancy situation that Chris never wanted anyone to see. Chris pulled them out of our group as soon as those cracks started to show. What he didn’t know is they trusted Johnny Grunge. Thank God he did. I loved Johnny Grunge. Don’t take this the wrong way. But, Johnny Grunge was a lovable f*** up. I remember at the last Nitro, I found him after the show laying in the dirt and he had taken like 15 Somas. I woke him up and said, “Why do you have to take 15? Why not just take 2?” He says, “It is no fun that way!” (laughs) That is a lovable f*** up! How could you be mad at him? Anyway, they stayed in contact with Grunge and they would go to Grunge when they would have problems because he couldn’t judge them because he was that lovable f*** up. Grunge would talk them down. He’d get them apart for a few days until things cooled down. But, I truly believe that if Johnny Grunge was still alive, so would they all be. Not a doubt in my mind. They lost their outlet.”
On if losing Eddie Guerrero made Chris crack:
“Well, he lost his mind (when Eddie died) but the only one he was comfortable telling all of his issues to was Grunge. The problem was Grunge would call me and tell me. I never said anything until after everything happened because it was none of my business. But, I knew. Johnny Grunge called me and told me, “Hey, Nancy stayed at my house fo a couple of days because they’re having issues. But, now everything is cool.” So, I knew. I wish I didn’t know. I wish I was like everyone else in wrestling and wanted to celebrate his life that night. But, that was a heavy burden to have on me. I remember Chris Jericho being on the phone with me for like 3, 4, maybe 6 hours. He just couldn’t understand. He would say, “Explain to me again what you saw! I didn’t see it!” He couldn’t understand. I guess at the time, I was doing what I was doing. They wanted me on Dateline on NBC and I never did any of those shows.”
On watching the Dark Side of the Ring on Chris Benoit:
“I watched the first episode of Dark Side of the Ring on Chris and Nancy… And, it took a long time for me to watch part 2 because I just didn’t want to relive it anymore. But, during the first episode, my wife said “put this on pause.” She ges upstairs. I have no idea why. She comes downstairs with the earrings that Nancy was wearing in the picture on the screen. Nancy had loaned her those earrings to wear to a wedding just before they disappeared from our group. It is things like that… It is a heavy burden, man. My wife was really emotional.”
On if choosing to write on the Benoit tragedy was difficult:
“It was a difficult thing to write about. I wasn’t sure I wanted to write about it… I went back and forth on it. But, if I’m going to write a book, I’ve got to be honest. There is no embellishing it… There is no covering for him. The guy was a sick motherfucker. He was a sociopath and he did the unthinkable. And, for those who say, “Well, can’t you separate that from his wrestling because he was a great wrestler?” No.”
On Hulk Hogan getting booed on WWE RAW:
“I like Hulk. He was always good to me. But, I’ll tell you what really bothered me most about that whole thing on RAW… Here is Hulk Hogan and he can barely walk out on the stage from everything he gave to the wrestling business and he gets booed. I mean, he could barely walk out onto the stage. Why? Because of a hidden recording where he was at his worst and said a word, not a word I’d ever use, but said a word? I’m sure if any of us had recordings of us in our darkest moments there would be things we wouldn’t want the world to know we’ve said or done. I think he knew that would be the response in LA thought.”
On if Hulk Hogan is truly MAGA:
“He is and I know he is because I asked Jimmy. But, it is great promotion. Trump is all about Make America Great Again, Hulk Hogan has a beer company called Real American Beer. It is genius promotion. But, he is MAGA and did the Republican National Convention.”
